The DC Universe Discussion

[Jake]

Since James Gunn has taken the helm for the entire DCU, he seems intent on righting the ship and pumping out some decent DC films over the next few years. The next film coming up for the DCU is Shazam: Fury of the Gods, anyone planning to see it?

 

[Bryan]

I can't say I care about the new Shazam, but I am interested in the new Flash film. I liked Michael Keaton's Batman, think I'd say he is my favorite Batman, even if Batman isn't my favorite Batman film necessarily. Hopefully Ezra Miller doesn't blow up a school bus or something before the new ones' released.

 

[Nick]

I absolutely loved the new Batman film. The directing of Matt Reeves, as well as the cinematography for it, it is something about DC films that is absent from the Marvel Cinematic Universe. In one swoop, Matt Reeves made The Batman, a film I believe is better than any film Marvel has ever created (barring, maybe, the first couple Raimi Spider-Man's), and it's because it allowed creative liberty and visual finesse.

In general, I like the Marvel Cinematic Universe more than the DC Cinematic Universe. In terms of cohesion and consistency, I have a lot of fun with Marvel. I like nearly Marvel film I see (some, even, I really like). I feel like, even when I dislike a Marvel film, I still kind of like it. A lot of the times, it feels like the opposite is true about DC. Even when I like something they do, I still kind of dislike it.

I was on-board for a lot of it. I was alright with Man of Steel, and I actually liked Batman v. Superman, but I always liked them in spite of themselves, if that makes sense. When a Marvel movie is bad, it still has that likability about it. When a DC movie is good, it still has that unlikability about it. I despised Suicide Squad and the Justice League film, and I disliked Aqua-Man. Birds of Prey was okay and The Suicide Squad was solid, but neither is a film I can see myself looking into again, same can be said about the first Shazam. Wonder Woman was solid. Its sequel was bad.

The Snyder cut of the Justice League was very good, in my opinion. That's an example of the type of grandiose ambition I believe DC has that Marvel simply doesn't.

 

[Jake]

I can't say I care about the new Shazam, but I am interested in the new Flash film. I liked Michael Keaton's Batman, think I'd say he is my favorite Batman, even if Batman isn't my favorite Batman film necessarily. Hopefully Ezra Miller doesn't blow up a school bus or something before the new ones' released.

Even with everything that's happened with Ezra Miller?

I will say that I really enjoyed the Christopher Nolan Batman films. I enjoyed Man of Steel, wasn't a big fan of Batman v Superman; but, I think a lot of that might stem from the fact that the executives kept asking for changes or alterations rather than letting Snyder do what he wanted. It was part of why I think he switched to working with Netflix.

 

[Nick]

Even with everything that's happened with Ezra Miller?

I will say that I really enjoyed the Christopher Nolan Batman films. I enjoyed Man of Steel, wasn't a big fan of Batman v Superman; but, I think a lot of that might stem from the fact that the executives kept asking for changes or alterations rather than letting Snyder do what he wanted. It was part of why I think he switched to working with Netflix.

The only thing I have difficulty "forgiving" or overlooking are the allegations about child-endangerment and kidnapping, but it doesn't look like they ever investigated that or probed deeper to see if there was any merit to it.

Everything else, although not okay, isn't enough to make me want to disqualify the film. Tim Allen sold cocaine. Who knows what Downey did in his stupors. Mark Wahlberg has a particularly ugly background. Ben Affleck was accused of sexual assault.

I am not saying I like Ezra Miller, but the threshold needed for me to disown a film with individuals I am interested in beyond him? I don't believe I have enough evidence to say he has crossed that yet.

 

[Maul]

I can't wait for The Flash. Not for Ezra obviously... but Michael Keaton <3

 

[Jake]

The only thing I have difficulty "forgiving" or overlooking are the allegations about child-endangerment and kidnapping, but it doesn't look like they ever investigated that or probed deeper to see if there was any merit to it.

They did have evidence from children he took to his ranch. They just never did anything to him about it. That's fair though, to each their own. I'll avoid the film. Can't stand the actor and he hasn't been a very good Flash for me. Give me the actor portraying Flash in the TV show over him.

 

[Rhett]

The new Shazam film is received mixed-to-average reviews from early screenings, whereas Aqua-Man 2 has reportedly receiving "terrible" reactions from test screenings, some even calling it the worst of the series so far.

 

[Maul]

I absolutely loved the new Batman film. The directing of Matt Reeves

I really didn't like the version of Penguin that was in this movie

 

[Nick]

I really didn't like the version of Penguin that was in this movie

To each his own, I loved it, personally. He is closer to the Batman: Arkham series' Penguin, where he is less over-the-top and more like an Al Capone, mafia-type. I liked Batman Returns' Penguin, but only because it was paired with Burton (whose unique styles pairs well with it) and Devito, otherwise, I don't like that version of Penguin.

 

[Bryan]

The new Shazam film is received mixed-to-average reviews from early screenings, whereas Aqua-Man 2 has reportedly receiving "terrible" reactions from test screenings, some even calling it the worst of the series so far.

The reviews have only worsened from what I have seen. I wonder where it will land in the end. If it tanks at the box office, I assume this will be the end of this iteration of Shazam. The way DC is treating this, it almost feels like a self-fulfilling prophecy where all the current iteration movies are sent out to their death.

 

[Plagueis]

The reviews have only worsened from what I have seen. I wonder where it will land in the end. If it tanks at the box office, I assume this will be the end of this iteration of Shazam. The way DC is treating this, it almost feels like a self-fulfilling prophecy where all the current iteration movies are sent out to their death.

I watched it. It's s'kay.

It isn't as bad as you may fear, but it isn't anything special either. With the Marvel movies (and DC too), we have come to expect sequels to improve on their predecessors. Look at The Dark Knight, X-Men 2, or Captain America: The Winter Soldier. for example. This feels more like the normal sequel, think Iron Man 2 or something like that. Shazam 1 was no Iron Man, mind you. This plays like a film with the charm of the first film, that is facing the laws of diminished returns.

 

[Tramuson]

I watched it. It's s'kay.

It isn't as bad as you may fear, but it isn't anything special either. With the Marvel movies (and DC too), we have come to expect sequels to improve on their predecessors. Look at The Dark Knight, X-Men 2, or Captain America: The Winter Soldier. for example. This feels more like the normal sequel, think Iron Man 2 or something like that. Shazam 1 was no Iron Man, mind you. This plays like a film with the charm of the first film, that is facing the laws of diminished returns.

The fact Zachary Levi remains so confident that Shazam will stay as a character hereafter is both sad and hilarious to think about. James Gunn clearly wants as much of a reset as he can possibly have. If Aqua-Man can make a billion-dollars and still look likely to be on the way out, piddly-diddly Shazam doesn't have a popsicles' chance in hell.

 

[Nick]

I have created a thread dedicated to the new Shazam film. Members can log their reviews and set a rating for the film here.​

 

[Nick]

The reviews have only worsened from what I have seen. I wonder where it will land in the end. If it tanks at the box office, I assume this will be the end of this iteration of Shazam. The way DC is treating this, it almost feels like a self-fulfilling prophecy where all the current iteration movies are sent out to their death.

Currently, the film is on-pace to land somewhere around 25-30 million in the United States.

That's bad for them.

To shed some light, superhero films often have a 'fanboy effect' to them. Basically, sequels are more front-loaded (as in, more of their money is made opening weekend than the original films which have a 'leggier' run), with fans of the original coming in and not a lot of new audience showing up for it.

The first Shazam! was considered a middleweight film in the DC Extended Universe (think Ant-Man, but graded on a curve for DC instead of Marvel). That film made 50 million in its opening weekend. So, for Shazam! 2 to make $25-30 million, nearly half of the original film, that bodes ill for its overtime prospects.

If it plays out half of what Shazam! made, it will make 70 million domestic and likely end up around 200-ish million worldwide (compared to Shazam's 140 million domestic and 370 million worldwide return).

More optimistically, I believe it will fall just shy of 100 million domestic and end up with about 250 million worldwide - but we won't know for certain where we stand until the overseas markets report back data.

If it does the more optimistic total of 250 million, that still means it will cost the studio money though.

If the film cost 125 million as reported, that'd be about 35 million more than the original film, which wasn't a major moneymaker to begin with.

 

[Jake]

I concur with the aforementioned statements about Gunn wanting a clean slate reboot. I think he wants to restart the universe for DC and I'm all for it if they stick to the darker elements and maybe throw in some more noir films to fit the DC writing and art styles. The cheery characters work for Marvel because you expect them. Not so for DC. I don't remember many upbeat stories in DC.

I'd love a Red Hood film or a Kingdom Come one.

 

[Nick]

I concur with the aforementioned statements about Gunn wanting a clean slate reboot. I think he wants to restart the universe for DC and I'm all for it if they stick to the darker elements and maybe throw in some more noir films to fit the DC writing and art styles. The cheery characters work for Marvel because you expect them. Not so for DC. I don't remember many upbeat stories in DC.

I'd love a Red Hood film or a Kingdom Come one.

Batman: Under the Red Hood remains one of my favorite DC Animated Movies by a long shot. In general, I like the direction that Matt Reeves is taking with the Batman series a lot (I am not certain if I like what he appears to have in mind for The Joker, however).

I saw Zachary Levi made a post about Shazam! and the conflicts with The Rock over Black Adam. Honestly, they can bicker as they will, but, personally, neither one matters on any significant level. It's a low stakes battle as far as characters / movies are concerned.

 

[Jake]

Batman: Under the Red Hood remains one of my favorite DC Animated Movies by a long shot. In general, I like the direction that Matt Reeves is taking with the Batman series a lot (I am not certain if I like what he appears to have in mind for The Joker, however).

I saw Zachary Levi made a post about Shazam! and the conflicts with The Rock over Black Adam. Honestly, they can bicker as they will, but, personally, neither one matters on any significant level. It's a low stakes battle as far as characters / movies are concerned.

Both of them are drops in the pond in regards to DC. I feel like a Green Lantern, Superman, Lobo, Batman or Robin film would receive a far more popular reception.

 

[Jobie]

Both of them are drops in the pond in regards to DC. I feel like a Green Lantern, Superman, Lobo, Batman or Robin film would receive a far more popular reception.

Shazam and Black Adam's placement in the greater DC is more like Lego Batman and Superpets, which is why it's funny to see them argue.

 

[Nick]

Shazam and Black Adam's placement in the greater DC is more like Lego Batman and Superpets, which is why it's funny to see them argue.

Yowch. For what it's worth, that Lego Batman movie is the bee's knees.